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Private Trackers vs NewGroups vs Public Trackers (Scene Releases)

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  • Private Trackers vs NewGroups vs Public Trackers (Scene Releases)

    I was looking around and trying to figure out who gets the scene releases first from the racers once they move them off the top site. Anyone care to share their opinion on this topic?
    Thanks.

  • #2
    good question i would be intrigued to know since i have been banned from BTN (@#[email protected]#$%)

    this is a torrent site but at the sametime good question.

    I need to get my releases asap before my isp goes from my uncapped account to my capped account where they are more stricter on torrents

    Comment


    • #3
      Originally posted by oomtas View Post
      good question i would be intrigued to know since i have been banned from BTN (@#[email protected]#$%)

      this is a torrent site but at the sametime good question.

      I need to get my releases asap before my isp goes from my uncapped account to my capped account where they are more stricter on torrents


      I am curious, why did they ban you?



      OP, SceneAccess is I believe considered the fastest tracker in pre times.

      Comment


      • #4
        Originally posted by Fante View Post
        I am curious, why did they ban you?



        OP, SceneAccess is I believe considered the fastest tracker in pre times.
        Long story there's soon to be more users from here... watch this space.

        Comment


        • #5
          Originally posted by Fante View Post
          I am curious, why did they ban you?



          OP, SceneAccess is I believe considered the fastest tracker in pre times.
          Their not that fast anymore. They use to be but other trackers have become faster. I wonder if newsgroups or public trackrs have become faster in releasing new content before private trackers. Need someone to clarify this.

          Comment


          • #6
            Private trackers still on top. I don't know about SCC, didn't compare them lately but IPT, FF, TSH, AR, GFT, SceneHD, DH are really on top. specially for big games releases which are I find the hardest to get fast. Middle Earth SOM is on gft and TSH at 6 minutes after the pre. However, I heard some indexers have even better pre-times but they are not many, still, as I heard they like 5 minutes after pre as maximum time and that should count for something !!!!. As for DDL, well, I don't use them but I'm on many and sig is the best.


            My guess, newsgroups or private trackers are similar but newsgroups don't need seeders and have initial great speed and that counts for something. Same to be said on top/best/some private trackers like gft, tsh .. etc but still not guaranteed in terms of percentage compared to newsgroups. This is just guessing and I still use private trackers :)

            Comment


            • #7
              In pure terms of practical time saving, more times that not, and especially true for new releases, by the time a torrent completes transfer so that I am are able to watch it, a newsgroup transfer will have completed and I will have watched 5-20 minutes (or longer in some cases) of it already. On many occasions, I've transferred an older release in the time it takes for a single advertisement to play on regular TV, I have not had the same experience with torrents. Of course, ymmv, this is simply my experience. However, torrents come into their own for older stuff, harder to find titles, and much more. The best thing is to never think *which is best*, use them all in symphony and then you *have the best*, the best of all worlds (or in geek speak, all protocols)

              Enjoy. :)
              Last edited by GameOn; August 4, 2015, 09:25 AM.

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              • #8
                Originally posted by GameOn View Post
                In pure terms of practical time saving, more times that not, and especially true for new releases, by the time a torrent completes transfer so that I am are able to watch it, a newsgroup transfer will have completed and I will have watched 5-20 minutes (or longer in some cases) of it already. On many occasions, I've transferred an older release in the time it takes for a single advertisement to play on regular TV, I have not had the same experience with torrents. Of course, ymmv, this is simply my experience. However, torrents come into their own for older stuff, harder to find titles, and much more. The best thing is to never think *which is best*, use them all in symphony and then you *have the best*, the best of all worlds (or in geek speak, all protocols)

                Enjoy. :)
                I've always found it quite fascinating that people actually care so much about pretimes. For a long time I assumed it was just a showing off thing, like, 'We're faster than you and therefore we're the best', but every so often I read a post like this where people are actually downloading and watching these things the second they are released by the scene, and I'm always really surprised.

                Personally, when I'm looking for a source for movies and TV shows, quality and choice is my first concern. I generally only watch Scene releases if they're the only thing available, because generally they suck quality-wise. The next thing is probably organisation. I use sites like BTN and PTP because they make it really easy to see what is available and find what I want. The amount of time I'm waiting comes third - I'm more than happy to wait a few days for a good quality P2P rip.

                I appreciate that this isn't how everyone feels, but then, I really think that if you're THAT obsessed with a show that you need to watch it the second it's released by the scene, surely in the vast majority of cases you can scrape up the cash or whatever to watch it on TV or at the cinema, as those will always get it before the scene does? Are there any other reasons for wanting it ASAP, other than really wanting to see the show? I suppose if you're wanting to upload things to other sites, you need to get a hold of things before anyone else. That's the only sensible need for lower pre-times that I can think of.

                Just sort of thinking out loud here, really.

                Comment


                • #9
                  Originally posted by Coal View Post
                  I've always found it quite fascinating that people actually care so much about pretimes. For a long time I assumed it was just a showing off thing, like, 'We're faster than you and therefore we're the best', but every so often I read a post like this where people are actually downloading and watching these things the second they are released by the scene, and I'm always really surprised.

                  Personally, when I'm looking for a source for movies and TV shows, quality and choice is my first concern. I generally only watch Scene releases if they're the only thing available, because generally they suck quality-wise. The next thing is probably organisation. I use sites like BTN and PTP because they make it really easy to see what is available and find what I want. The amount of time I'm waiting comes third - I'm more than happy to wait a few days for a good quality P2P rip.

                  I appreciate that this isn't how everyone feels, but then, I really think that if you're THAT obsessed with a show that you need to watch it the second it's released by the scene, surely in the vast majority of cases you can scrape up the cash or whatever to watch it on TV or at the cinema, as those will always get it before the scene does? Are there any other reasons for wanting it ASAP, other than really wanting to see the show? I suppose if you're wanting to upload things to other sites, you need to get a hold of things before anyone else. That's the only sensible need for lower pre-times that I can think of.

                  Just sort of thinking out loud here, really.
                  I don't really care for pre-times either, i was sharing a particular use case where identical quality releases are made available across multiple protocols. Note, I was clear not to state one is better than the other, indeed I recommend to use them all. So, why it surprises that an episode of a show is watched as soon as it is released in the best quality wanted is a wonder to my mind.

                  My systems are automated, I can choose to auto upgrade the first release made available to a better quality or simply wait for a better quality in the first instance. I don't waste time waiting and manually finding, to me that process predates using rss and is best left in 1998. My systems are set to my preferences and do as computers do best, that is, compute, process and keep things *very* well organised. I also have very close to zero bad quality releases, but then my curated suppliers have taken time to build and are very good - thus high quality comes as standard. Crap quality is often due to crap suppliers like anything.

                  I'll add that if scene releases did not exist, then the lack of the counsel agreed and documented release standards that cover such things as consistent filenaming, codec use, and other technical areas would result in the p2p space resembling the wild west of the anime space. Thankfully, those standards have bled into p2p to create a level of organisation that means one can write for and trust automation to do a lot of heavy lifting, which means we can do more IRL stuff, winner.

                  It isn't an obsession thing, its an organisational thing, we all have different methods, some prefer a hands on approach, others have their stuff locked down in precision custom automation. Simple. Finally, yes i love going to watch iMax movies and my FTTH media provider receives over 110 per month from me on TV, On Demand, and Sports packages so I consider your tones a bit presumptuous and a little misguided here.
                  Last edited by GameOn; August 4, 2015, 09:29 PM.

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    Originally posted by GameOn View Post
                    I don't really care for pre-times either, i was sharing a particular use case where identical quality releases are made available across multiple protocols. Note, I was clear not to state one is better than the other, indeed I recommend to use them all. So, why it surprises that an episode of a show is watched as soon as it is released in the best quality wanted is a wonder to my mind.

                    My systems are automated, I can choose to auto upgrade the first release made available to a better quality or simply wait for a better quality in the first instance. I don't waste time waiting and manually finding, to me that process predates using rss and is best left in 1998. My systems are set to my preferences and do as computers do best, that is, compute, process and keep things *very* well organised. I also have very close to zero bad quality releases, but then my curated suppliers have taken time to build and are very good - thus high quality comes as standard. Crap quality is often due to crap suppliers like anything.

                    I'll add that if scene releases did not exist, then the lack of the counsel agreed and documented release standards that cover such things as consistent filenaming, codec use, and other technical areas would result in the p2p space resembling the wild west of the anime space. Thankfully, those standards have bled into p2p to create a level of organisation that means one can write for and trust automation to do a lot of heavy lifting, which means we can do more IRL stuff, winner.

                    It isn't an obsession thing, its an organisational thing, we all have different methods, some prefer a hands on approach, others have their stuff locked down in precision custom automation. Simple. Finally, yes i love going to watch iMax movies and my FTTH media provider receives over 110 per month from me on TV, On Demand, and Sports packages so I consider your tones a bit presumptuous and a little misguided here.
                    All of that is fair enough, and are valid reasons to use scene releases. Your automated system sounds like a good solution for someone who watches (or collects) a lot of media. I'll agree with you that scene releases tend to be consistent and well-organised. You still haven't explained the reasoning behind needing things as quickly as possible, though. I also don't understand why you need to use all three sources when one would suffice - doesn't this needlessly complicate your system? If the reason is to get things as quickly as possible, why is that, if not obsession?

                    I disagree with you on the point of quality - while scene releases are never terrible to the point of being unwatchable, they are generally very low bit rate for the resolution they are, resulting in quite a big loss of quality - they're far from transparent encodes. For some shows this won't be a big deal (like the animated ones) for most people, myself included, but for shows like Game of Thrones and movies I'd never choose a scene release - for TV I'll get either a BTN internal or a P2P release, and for movies I'll get whatever has the golden popcorn on PTP.

                    Anyway, you seem to have taken my comments personally, and that wasn't my intention, they were just some musings about pre-times and you happened to be the one who posted. I don't really see how I was being misguided about your TV subscriptions at all, but you pointing out that you do have those subscriptions makes me wonder even more what the need is to have scene releases so quickly.

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      Originally posted by Coal View Post
                      All of that is fair enough, and are valid reasons to use scene releases. Your automated system sounds like a good solution for someone who watches (or collects) a lot of media. I'll agree with you that scene releases tend to be consistent and well-organised. You still haven't explained the reasoning behind needing things as quickly as possible, though. I also don't understand why you need to use all three sources when one would suffice - doesn't this needlessly complicate your system? If the reason is to get things as quickly as possible, why is that, if not obsession?

                      I disagree with you on the point of quality - while scene releases are never terrible to the point of being unwatchable, they are generally very low bit rate for the resolution they are, resulting in quite a big loss of quality - they're far from transparent encodes. For some shows this won't be a big deal (like the animated ones) for most people, myself included, but for shows like Game of Thrones and movies I'd never choose a scene release - for TV I'll get either a BTN internal or a P2P release, and for movies I'll get whatever has the golden popcorn on PTP.

                      Anyway, you seem to have taken my comments personally, and that wasn't my intention, they were just some musings about pre-times and you happened to be the one who posted. I don't really see how I was being misguided about your TV subscriptions at all, but you pointing out that you do have those subscriptions makes me wonder even more what the need is to have scene releases so quickly.
                      Ahh, you're focusing on the wrong thing, there isn't a "need is to have scene releases so quickly". Automation inherently delivers things as and when they are released to the quality that I set for that show, without delay and without user intervention, guaranteed and reliably. So for example, GoT was fetched in 1080p from a specified source whose focus is indeed high bitrate (nb. BTN releases are not exclusive to torrents), other releases existed but were skipped over. So going back to the point of my findings, I simply compared the total time taken to complete the transfer for an identical release over two protocols. Torrents in the overwhelming majority of cases take longer, that is a simple fact for me, the readers mileage *may* vary, but I doubt it. All that said, another use case is when we are going through 2 or three episodes of an older series, wife steps out for 60 seconds, when she comes back, the next episode has downloaded, processed and is ready in our TV to watch, the speed in that scenario is something that I do enjoy and don't take for granted.

                      I have never been a fan of big lights are shinier than small ones as I have proven time over that one source is never a panacea for everything that is made available. Also, making systems simple can and often means a lack of capability to do more - I don't like that. "Needless complexity" - not at all, I use one protocol for automation, and the others for other stuff. I get the best that I can from all spaces and don't limit myself.

                      To answer why I automate over watching from TV; 1) I can't stand adverts within TV shows 2) I want to watch what I want when I want 3) The media companies STB is not a match for homebrew, its capacity alone is offensive.

                      Finally, having said all that, we still watch stuff on TV. Again, I keep as much availability as possible - which most certainly includes traditional TV sources.

                      :)
                      Last edited by GameOn; August 5, 2015, 07:54 AM.

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        Originally posted by GameOn View Post
                        Ahh, you're focusing on the wrong thing, there isn't a "need is to have scene releases so quickly". Automation inherently delivers things as and when they are released to the quality that I set for that show, without delay and without user intervention, guaranteed and reliably. So for example, GoT was fetched in 1080p from a specified source whose focus is indeed high bitrate (nb. BTN releases are not exclusive to torrents), other releases existed but were skipped over. So going back to the point of my findings, I simply compared the total time taken to complete the transfer for an identical release over two protocols. Torrents in the overwhelming majority of cases take longer, that is a simple fact for me, the readers mileage *may* vary, but I doubt it. All that said, another use case is when we are going through 2 or three episodes of an older series, wife steps out for 60 seconds, when she comes back, the next episode has downloaded, processed and is ready in our TV to watch, the speed in that scenario is something that I do enjoy and don't take for granted.

                        I have never been a fan of big lights are shinier than small ones as I have proven time over that one source is never a panacea for everything that is made available. Also, making systems simple can and often means a lack of capability to do more - I don't like that. "Needless complexity" - not at all, I use one protocol for automation, and the others for other stuff. I get the best that I can from all spaces and don't limit myself.

                        To answer why I automate over watching from TV; 1) I can't stand adverts within TV shows 2) I want to watch what I want when I want 3) The media companies STB is not a match for homebrew, its capacity alone is offensive.

                        Finally, having said all that, we still watch stuff on TV. Again, I keep as much availability as possible - which most certainly includes traditional TV sources.

                        :)
                        Fair enough, I think I slightly misread your original post - this thread is about pretimes so I assumed that's what you were talking about, but you were actually going slightly offtopic and talking about download speeds.

                        I agree 100% about adverts and the inconvenience of watching things on TV, and I obviously also prefer to pirate for convenience. I was merely asking why people (but now, I realise, not yourself) who are seemingly obsessed with pre-times don't watch the shows they absolutely need to watch as soon as they can on their original media. Obviously that's not a question you'll be able to answer.

                        As an aside, I haven't had the same results as you regarding speeds - with private torrents from the trackers I use, I am generally able to max out my download speed (whether on my seedbox or at home). I haven't used newsgroups very much, but my experience of them is that the speed depends on how busy the server is and chances are you won't get anywhere near 100mbps download.

                        Regarding BTN internals, I'm sure many of them turn up in other places, but I'd be very surprised to find the same choice that BTN offers (in all releases, not just internals) anywhere else.

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          Originally posted by Coal View Post
                          Fair enough, I think I slightly misread your original post - this thread is about pretimes so I assumed that's what you were talking about, but you were actually going slightly offtopic and talking about download speeds.

                          I agree 100% about adverts and the inconvenience of watching things on TV, and I obviously also prefer to pirate for convenience. I was merely asking why people (but now, I realise, not yourself) who are seemingly obsessed with pre-times don't watch the shows they absolutely need to watch as soon as they can on their original media. Obviously that's not a question you'll be able to answer.

                          As an aside, I haven't had the same results as you regarding speeds - with private torrents from the trackers I use, I am generally able to max out my download speed (whether on my seedbox or at home). I haven't used newsgroups very much, but my experience of them is that the speed depends on how busy the server is and chances are you won't get anywhere near 100mbps download.

                          Regarding BTN internals, I'm sure many of them turn up in other places, but I'd be very surprised to find the same choice that BTN offers (in all releases, not just internals) anywhere else.
                          I wasn't really about download speeds but more the actual effect of pretimes to the whole experience as played out in a practical situation. That is, different sources affect the time taken for a transmission mechanism to complete due to a) pretime + b) actual download throughput + c) unpar/unrar/sfv/file sync/transfer from seedbox (seeding time is a little off-topic but still part of the entire process).

                          All of the above processes add up such that time savings can be substantially saved regardless of when something is actually released, that is why I used the wording "total time" - often people don't include all steps when eager to promote a particular methodology. I'm not sure what USP server you were using, but I do know that servers do make a difference, much the same as any network type. In my experience, I **must** QoS newsgroup throughput to prevent it maxing the pipe at 100mpbs and blocking other net activity, I have never maxed torrent.

                          Regarding your question about watching shows on original media as soon as available. I'd wager that adverts and convenience probably covers that, not to mention content that is simply not available on original media. For example, Sky Atlantic is not on VM, therefore True Detectives, Fargo and other shows can only be sourced via the net and people will want to watch ASAP. Oh, even "Humans" is cut for AMC (usa) to insert more advertising. Then there is OTT content which is set to screw the markets up even more as exclusivity deals simply foster a greater desire to use creative solutions to harvest media.

                          Yup, BTN has a great selection, however, for my needs I find BTN useful for exceptional rare cases rather than the norm because most current things are simply easier to attain elsewhere.

                          :)
                          Last edited by GameOn; August 5, 2015, 09:16 AM.

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