Thread: P2P under attack, ACTA secret negotions on now

It may sound arcane to many of you but this will directly impact your life. ACTA (Anti-Counterfeiting Trade Agreement) is a secret agreement being negotiated by many of the countries of the world. You can read about it on wikipedia here:
Anti-Counterfeiting Trade Agreement - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

The act has many provisions the scariest of which is the "three-strikes and you are out" rule. This would force and ISP to permanently cut off your Internet access if you have been caught file sharing three times.

I urge you all to read up on this and see how it might impact your country. The best place to follow it is at Michel Geist's blog:

Michael Geist - The ACTA Guide, Part One: The Talks To-Date



He has been doing an amazing job of finding out what is going on behind the scenes.

for those fellow Canadians on the forum, this act is being strongly supported by the Harper government to the point that one of the rounds of secret negotiations is scheduled to be here.

The act would completely change the nature of Canadian copyright law. P2P would become illegal here and our long held legal doctrine of fair use (i.e. why we pay a tax on blank media) would be eliminated. Canadians would soon be facing legal action from the likes of the RIAA and MPAA, just like our American brethren.

P.S. could a mod fix my horrendous spelling error in the title please?

My first question is, if it's so secret, how is it in wikipedia.

My second question is, how is this any different than now. Let's be honest. For most of us, it's already illegal what we do.

Bottom line is, yes it may become *illegal* in more places, but it won't become any easier to catch. Laws adapt, and those who evade the laws adapt as well. It will always be a race, but as long as you keep your knowledge up to date it's not a hard one to win.

I honestly believe if all piracy was shut down, the media industries would nearly crumble. There are two types of people who pirate media - the type who do it to back up files, or do it to see if they like a film, and then buy it if they do. And the type that wouldn't buy it even if they couldn't get it from a tracker, just because they don't want to waste money on it.

If someone knows they like something, and they can afford to buy it, chances are they will.


My THIRD question is - how does it benefit an ISP (which is a business) to permanently cut off hundreds, to thousands of customers simply for file sharing, and thus lose that much money every month.


Think about your average bill you pay for internet. Find out how many people your ISP provides service to (if you can) and then figure at least half of those are pirates (even though last I checked 35% of internet traffic is supposedly due to BitTorrent, another 20% is due to other p2p sharing - 55% of all internet usage).

What company can afford to say to over half of its customers "sorry, get lost, go find a competitor".

The more likely thing will be that a LOT of ISPs will bend the rules and only say something if you're being extreme about it.

NOW

Another thing altogether is this - piracy is evolving just as fast as the anti-piracy laws are. Look through our own forums, you'll see one post about a group that lets you pay 10 dollars monthly for access from files directly from the scene, not a tracker. There is also discussion of a "next generation" torrenting set up which works in a completely different, more secure, way.

Originally Posted by Jschro14

My first question is, if it's so secret, how is it in wikipedia.

I dont say secret in some tinfoil hat wearing way. They are being negotiated in secret. Read Geist's blog. It is scary how something so important in being done behind the backs of the citizens of nearly every country.

Originally Posted by Jschro14

My second question is, how is this any different than now. Let's be honest. For most of us, it's already illegal what we do.

It is not illegal in many countries. For example, in Canada P2P is perfectly legal at the moment although this is very likely to change.

Originally Posted by Jschro14

My THIRD question is - how does it benefit an ISP (which is a business) to permanently cut off hundreds, to thousands of customers simply for file sharing, and thus lose that much money every month.
[/COLOR]

It would not benefit an ISP but that is irrelevant if their country of origin makes it law.

Originally Posted by Jschro14

Another thing altogether is this - piracy is evolving just as fast as the anti-piracy laws are. Look through our own forums, you'll see one post about a group that lets you pay 10 dollars monthly for access from files directly from the scene, not a tracker. There is also discussion of a "next generation" torrenting set up which works in a completely different, more secure, way.

I agree that they are never going to stop piracy but that does not mean we should not be educated about the actions our governments are taking if we do not agree with them.

Oh, I think you got the wrong idea. I'm greatly in agreement with you that this was worth posting, in fact if I could provide you with rep in addition to the thanks I already gave you I would.

I'm simply saying I wouldn't panic about it just yet. I also wouldn't expect many ISPs to follow the law to the letter and start banning people even if they were legally required to do so.

Edit: I also firmly agree that we need more transparency in our governments. I'm not sure what the origins of Canadian government were, but I know that the founding fathers of the US intended government to exist for the sole purpose of protecting citizens from foreign and domestic threats, and giving people the safety and security to pursue a life of happiness. In recent years government has become more of a watchdog group than a protector. Corruption throughout the entire system.

Originally Posted by Jschro14

Oh, I think you got the wrong idea. I'm greatly in agreement with you that this was worth posting, in fact if I could provide you with rep in addition to the thanks I already gave you I would.

I'm simply saying I wouldn't panic about it just yet. I also wouldn't expect many ISPs to follow the law to the letter and start banning people even if they were legally required to do so.

Sorry if my response seemed harsh I didnt mean it that way at all. I am glad you found it interesting and I agree it is not time to panic.

I just wanted to educate people since the secrecy of this whole process it really hiding it from most. I would guess most people will have never even heard of ACTA.

Damn...Romania is there as well but there is still hope. European Union can't enforce things like this to a member country AFAIK.

As stated above it's not profitable for ISP's, but if it's enforced on them and they are monitored it's better to be less profitable than out of business...that's what I think.

Piracy won't die, but it will get harder to get what you need. p2p is so simple to use...not so sure about the other methods.

Here is an article discussing the EU's role in ACTA negotiations;

http://www.europarl.europa.eu/news/e...default_es.htm

Originally Posted by andi

Damn...Romania is there as well but there is still hope. European Union can't enforce things like this to a member country AFAIK.

As stated above it's not profitable for ISP's, but if it's enforced on them and they are monitored it's better to be less profitable than out of business...that's what I think.

Piracy won't die, but it will get harder to get what you need. p2p is so simple to use...not so sure about the other methods.

That's the problem, the monitoring. Governments are the least efficient organizations in the world (out of all the money that is spent governments have the largest percentage unaccounted for). I just don't see how a private organization can enforce this without the help of each individual government - and as such - I don't see this being a top priority.

It's not exactly the type of thing you can go on the news and brag about. What's Obama going to do, claim he's winning the "War On Sharing"?..... suppose that would be the best thing he could claim so far, but you understand my point.