Magnitud3

obviously its not ratioless even if they say so.
but the bonus system is a plus point which is a very good feature to keep goin on at the tracker.

This is a good anti-hnr system. Hnr's dont seed, don,t stay more than 1 month and download big amounts of data at once. 50 gigs is a long road? hah. my friend downloads 1 DVD in 12 minutes. so, 50 G = 3 hour-long leeching. And the bonus system gives to "nonleecher" the opportunity to climb up from bad ratio.

Hi guys and thanks for answering.

Originally Posted by Svarog

50 gigs is a long road? hah. my friend downloads 1 DVD in 12 minutes. so, 50 G = 3 hour-long leeching.

Well, I'm not arguing that getting to download 50 Gb requires a lot of time. Possibly the opposite, Svarog. As I explained in the post the system they picked is confusing at times and it isn't well described. The very fact they decided to use the 50 Gbytes barrier for both upload and download is an indication of it.
Reaching the 50 Gb download margin as quickly as you pointed out works very well against you, unless you have uploaded the same amount already. Highly unlikely. Let's make clear we aren't talking about seeding 50 Gb, which after you've finished downloading them, takes less than a click, of course, but uploading 50 Gb.
As you see appreciating the difference it's fairly uncomplicated matter.
Uploading 50 Gb per se isn't tremendous. It can be accomplished with a nice load of patience, but what makes it a "long journey", I supposed, it's the fact you get demoted if not maintaining a 1:1 ratio in the first four weeks. Basically you have to keep watching out your ratio until the day you have uploaded 50 Gb.
That's many things, but surely isn't ratioless - my simple point.

Originally Posted by don_rocks

obviously its not ratioless even if they say so.
but the bonus system is a plus point which is a very good feature to keep goin on at the tracker.

I'm happy for you that you feel these pointers are obvious, but I thought wasn't the same to everybody, that's why I wrote the blog in the first place.
If you take the time to read the FAQ and make sure you've understood them well you're always safer from getting warnings or getting disabled.
Also consider that only here at TI some users said PTM is ratioless, while the tracker is considering itself "global ratio-free", which sounds more like an adv to me, because it doesn't mean much. No offense to the advertisement industry implied.



I'm finding the Bonus Point system slower to matter than I've expected. What do you think about it?

"However this system is also based on the willingness to share or at least trying to share. Therefore there are a couple of rules set in place to prevent abuse of this system."

This system is just in place to avoid users creating an account, leeching like hell within the first few weeks capping their upload and never be punished for that behavior.

As you stated correctly after 4 weeks of membership you are free of limitations and the system becomes globally ratio free. If you generally stay above 1:1 it shouldn't bother you anyways and imho that is the goal of torrenting, because if you don't someone else has to suffer.

Every tracker I know has such a H&R system in place. Most of them counting individual torrent ratio. Even on ratio free trackers you always have to keep your ratio in mind, if it is shown openly or not.

As long as you are seeding your torrents either to 0.75 or for 60 hours straight you never have to worry about being disabled or demoted.

Hi Zealot,
thank you for contributing.

I take your side for what concern the fairness of the system in place at PTM. I prefer it over many other classical trackers where there's no point gathering involved and you have to be careful on what you download all the time because it affects your ratio balance negatively. I purely wanted to clarify PTM rules and that it wasn't ratioless.

Also I sustain what torrenting is for you, and many others, I believe; I do think that it's all about sharing and keeping the scale in favor of offering, regardless how much you're receiving. I never meant anything less.

Nonetheless there's system that are fully ratioless, letting you download as much as you please and merely asking you back seeding time, as you suggested. Commonly 48 hours, 60 the most and in some trackers you have up to 12 idle hours before getting H&R. Very comfortable. On such trackers how much you download is insignificant.
Therefore if you ask me and I'm bound to answer from a torrent client user standpoint, I'd say that's the smartest way to work. You don't put much pressure on the users and you get back up to two day and a half of seeding for every download that goes out.

It's still practically ratioless. I mean, even if you don't upload 50GB and then end up being demoted to Probie class, you can still download at least 1 torrent at a time (plus however many download slots you have purchased). So they allow you to download, even with a low ratio. Isn't that 'ratioless'? This is not like other ratio trackers that disable your downloading or whatever for a bad ratio.
Plus, a global ratio of 0.05 leads to a ban, but it takes a lot of skill and strategy to force your ratio that low. PreToMe isn't that difficult to seed, and quite a few people leech new torrents. So I would think it difficult to reach that low of a ratio.
As for the bonus points, you can earn more for seed times as well as upload speed. So if you retain a torrent for longer, even with no leechers, you'll earn more points.

Originally Posted by buzz

It's still practically ratioless. I mean, even if you don't upload 50GB and then end up being demoted to Probie class, you can still download at least 1 torrent at a time (plus however many download slots you have purchased). So they allow you to download, even with a low ratio. Isn't that 'ratioless'? This is not like other ratio trackers that disable your downloading or whatever for a bad ratio.
Plus, a global ratio of 0.05 leads to a ban, but it takes a lot of skill and strategy to force your ratio that low. PreToMe isn't that difficult to seed, and quite a few people leech new torrents. So I would think it difficult to reach that low of a ratio.
As for the bonus points, you can earn more for seed times as well as upload speed. So if you retain a torrent for longer, even with no leechers, you'll earn more points.

This. Also, if they didn't have this in place, people could just limit their upload speed entirely, which is not beneficial to the health of the site.

I'm with buzz and Sticky on this. Like many other users I wasn't paying complete attention to the 50GB rule and I got demoted to probie for a month. This ended up limiting me in no way, and I've been able to easily climb ranks since then without having to worry about ratio. You could spend your entire time on this tracker at a 10% ratio, and if you didn't mind the temp one month restriction to 1 download at a time, it wouldn't matter. That sounds like the best implementation of a ratioless system I've seen.

Still, we aren't flaming your magnitud3. It's great that you bring these small things to light, because I would say most aren't aware of these specific rules. There must always be a catch.

Buzz, Sticky and EnderWiggin thank you for sharing your opinions,

Originally Posted by buzz

So they allow you to download, even with a low ratio. Isn't that 'ratioless'? This is not like other ratio trackers that disable your downloading or whatever for a bad ratio.
Plus, a global ratio of 0.05 leads to a ban, but it takes a lot of skill and strategy to force your ratio that low.

True what you've been saying about the PTM demotion. I'm glad you took the time to go through the site FAQ before posting your views.
It's somewhat straightforward define how a ratioless tracker operates: ratio is not reported because absolutely irrelevant, it doesn't have ruling about, nor restrains downloading to any extent. AO is a beautiful example of this very serious way of standing up. It's not alone.

EnderWiggin's reply made it easier to me to explain how the system really works. Put differently 0.05 ratio is 5% of your own total uploading relative to your own total downloading. Therefore the 0.05 ratio over 50 downloaded Gbytes is 2.5 uploaded Gbytes for example.
Sticking to 3 Gbs of uploading (0.06) every 50 Gb of downloading is affordable indeed, isn't it? Let's see. 100 dn over 6 up, 200 dn over 12 up and so on.
You can download 500 Gb and having had to upload only 25 Gb. That's a great concrete execution of a ratio controlled tracker by all means. That is to say that since the limitation on 0.05 ratio is always enforced, PTM isn't ratioless and in the four weeks of membership far from being so, as I've already pointed out.

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ON A SIDE NOTE:
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Let's not forget offering torrent tracking is legitimate as long as you don't host (or it legally appears you don't) the actual data.
Yet at any level some of us know where the data is coming from and the whereabouts of how it's gotten there. Still we seem to ignore it's never meant to be that way and we weren't supposed to have it.
I won't use that name everybody knows and abuses, but those few people hates what we're doing because endangers them. Consequently when I hear the word "purchase" to anything torrent correlated, I can take it to say the least.
The waters we're swimming in are not in any shape a Business. They've never meant to be about making money. In any conceivable forms. Ever.
There're trackers like PTF offering all sort of entertainments - games, casino etc. - to keep you on the site, other having ads and telling you could live without them by paying for a VIP status. The list goes on. Some people thought to turn everything into a business.
That's obnoxious to me as I can't accept anything that isn't utterly free willing donation. I think users that don't think in these terms should think harder.
Food for thoughts. I'm expecting strong replys.

I thought I'd lower down the tone of the previous burst (absolutely no blame to anybody intended) by getting back the conversation to PTM, which is what this blog was all about, wasn't it?


There's a simple calculation you can make to know exactly how many bytes you can still download before falling to disabling rules. In your User Info menu box at the bottom where "total" is, you take the number in parenthesis, multiply it to 100 and divide it by 6.

ex. (23.19 GB up) --------------> (23.19 * 100) / 6 = 386.5

The result represents the maximum amount of Gbytes - in most cases - you can safely download without occurring into punishments. Naturally the calculation's to be done after each time you've uploaded new data.
However keep in mind this shortcut ONLY starts to be applicable from the second month of membership. Remember that in your first 4 weeks you are forced to keep an even ratio after having downloaded 50 Gbs, as we discussed earlier.
Despite what's just been said, if you stay under the 50 Gb radar during the first month, the calculated value is always effective. That is to say you need to upload more than 5 Gbs.
Have fun!

ehh even trackers like PTN give you upload and download stats. So PTM is a ratioless its just that you can figure out your ratio if you want too.

Do i see this as a problem ? No, the site is just fine as is.

Hi argst and thanks for posting.

PTN is ratioless. Requires 72 hours of seeding for every torrent you snatch. That's all. No matter your ratio or how many downloads (or uploads). I think of it as the best system approach and it's been used in a lot of 1337 trackers for a reason indeed.
PTN has a system similar to AO I've suggested above, the latter being of lower caliber in many ways, of course.

PTM has a ratio rule always in place. Thus you need to be careful because if you start treating the tracker like PTN - or any other ratioless ones -, soon your upload ratio will crash at 0.05 getting you banned. Read the blog to clear any doubts or even better, read the PTM's FAQ.

Hi everybody,

I hope this short blog has been useful to some of you. I won't be posting anymore comments although I will keep answering to your posts, of course. Thank you to all the users that replied and to all the readers. I'll be seeing you in the next blog.

Good Luck all with your trackers hunt!