Isn't torrent ratios a zero-sum game? ie how can everyone have a >1 ratio? - Page 2
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Thread: Isn't torrent ratios a zero-sum game? ie how can everyone have a >1 ratio?

  1. #11

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    I feel like I've fallen down the rabbit hole here. This whole discussion is predicated on erroneous assumptions. Tracker rules vary of course, but in particular, the following is not an established fact. Nor is the hypothesis that this is a zero sum game.

    Quote Originally Posted by make_music
    In order to increase your ratio, you need to decreases someone else's.

    It is easy to think that your upload must come from someone else downloading your torrent. But that isn't necessarily so. And even if it was, the tracker member pool is open ended, not static. Members with poor ratios become inactive or disabled all the time and many trackers have an open ended influx of new users. Members may start with a "free" upload bonus, there may be freeleech, partial leech or neutral leech torrents, bonus points or other incentives and conditions that all impact ratio. And yes, there really are a lot of users with abysmal ratios.

    So, without a careful study of the dynamics and statistics here, this isn't much more than a pub game, guessing how it all balances out. And in the end.. does it really affect most users that much? It's easy to achieve an abysmal ratio: typical result - being disabled. And a bit of work to keep a good ratio.. but I've yet to see the tracker where it can't be done. Even so called hard to seed trackers e.g. waffles, what, music-vid, pianosheets, et al. So.. my question would be: is anyone really trying to delineate a well thought out technical analysis here? Or is this just a good natured, make a guess at what is going on territory? Cause it seems like the latter and in that case.. I think that Leprechauns fiddle the numbers.

    UltraSbox likes this.
    Fortune and love favour the brave .-. Ovid ....


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  3. #12

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    What you are suggesting is correct in theory, should you upload 10GB someone needs to download that 10GB from you. In practice many trackers tweak the numbers in a way or another and the stats you see don't reflect actual transfer numbers. Most trackers don't require you to have a >1 ratio to survive on the site, or at least you get to download a certain amount of gigabytes before the ratio requirement kicks in. If a tracker requires you to have a >1 ratio and it has no bonuses, freeleech or anything else to make things easier the last possibility is indeed that users with high ratios live to the detriment of new users who are being banned.



    There are many different ways of getting free upload/download or bonus that you can use to "buy" more upload:
    Freeleech torrents
    Partially freeleech torrents (75%, 50%, 33% etc.)
    Upload multiplier (e.g. 2x upload)
    Seed bonus (certain amount of points per hour)
    IRC bonus (you get points for idling on the main IRC channel of the site)
    Other bonuses (upload bonus, commenting bonus, saying thanks etc.)
    Site-wide freeleech (e.g. 24 hours)
    Site-wide ratio building (e.g. 50% download counted, 150% upload counted)
    Donating
    Competitions
    Games
    Lottery
    Starting buffer
    Filling out surveys
    Helping out with torrent descriptions
    Finding bugs

    "neutral leech" shouldn't really affect in the way or the other since neither upload nor download is counted


    Examples of required ratios on "hard to seed" sites:
    TorrentLeech: 0.4 (VIPs get immunity to the auto-ban because of low ratio)
    WhatCD: 0.6 (0.6 is the requirement after you have downloaded 100GB, they have freeleech staff picks and sometimes site-wide freeleech)
    Waffles: 0.5 (0.5 is the requirement after you have downloaded 125GB, they also have freeleech staff picks and sometimes site-wide freeleech)
    Bibliotik: 0.8 (0.8 is the requirement after you have downloaded 50GB, ratio requirement doesn't apply to users who have uploaded 100 torrents)


    Examples of ratioless trackers:
    FYT
    AlphaOmega
    PTM (almost ratioless)
    GFT
    FTN
    nCore
    BTN
    PTN
    FHD (DL credits system)
    MTN
    RuTracker (no ban because of low ratio)
    Demonoid (no ban because of low ratio)
    Last edited by mate88; January 19th, 2012 at 04:25 AM.
    dies_irae likes this.

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